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The Ego, Big Mind, and Second-Tier Self as an expression of the Upper Quad

Posted June 3rd, 2010 by Daruma Matsumoto

One of my main questions from a purely flat cosmos perspective that is anchored in I-am-ness regards the extent to which expressions of our Self - by which I mean, true Authentic Self that is in the Present and the Now - is interconnected with our Energy Self as Holons. As we are all Holons, functioning, as each expression of our Self not only as our Self but also reflections of Others, can interconnected-ness and the self-awareness that comes from opperating in a state or perpetual Big Mind-ness, really function in the various other Quadrants over time? This is perhaps a simple question to answer for many Integral Lifers, and I feel almost sanguine for asking it.

Furthermore, what of God? In which Quadrant does God function and what depth of my Holon is God anchored? Does interconnectedness and intercontemporarity really affect how I endeavour to express the Ego as functions - higher and lower respectively - of True Self?

When we apply these questions to Ken Wilber in the context of AQAL, what does it reveal? Is there shadow? What of third, fourth and fifth tier consciousness?

Moreover, do you think that on these retreats he makes you pay thousands of dollars to attend that Ken ever bangs any of his followers? Most of them have low self-esteem and are very vulnerable, so why wouldn't he take advantage of that? I'm sure he must have done. He has so much power over some of you people it's frightening. I'm sure that there is more than a few of you who'd be willing to lovingly devour Ken's "magenta holon", so to speak, if he promised to teach you how to reach a higher tier in return, amirite?

Have any of you done a background check on Ken Wilber? Have you wondered why a guy who has transcended Ego needs a naked CGI version of himself on his website? Have you read his early scholarly work and how interesting it was? Have you read the critiques? Have you noticed the huge disparity between the quality of his work as an academic two decades ago and the pseudo-scientific New Age Spirituality nonsense he is trying to sell to you people today? The guy has lost it. It's a tragedy. He has taken the wrong path, a lot of people have followed him, and now he can't turn back.

And you're paying money for pointless nonsense that is distracting you from actually living and enjoying a personally fulfilling life. You don't need a theoretical framework to give life meaning. Spend time with your family. Take a walk in nature. Do some volunteer work. Enrol in an evening class. Or, just spend time on your own. You don't need a guru, a life coach or a cult leader. You can survive on your own.

Your reflections on this are more than welcome and I encourage multi-level interaction with all of you.

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Interesting but Limited Perspective.

Posted August 9th, 2010 by Julius Ko

Daruma,

You write very passionately and there seems to be some resentment towards the 'followers of KW' and critiques of his work.  I have to give it to you; members here (myself included) are probably sometimes a little too enthusiastic about Wilber and/or his work.  Additionally, you raise interesting questions about holes or questions about his theory, which like anything else in the world; is not full-proof.

That being said, I find what you write to be written without much regard on the positive aspects of Wilber's work and this community in general.  You must feel it in your bones as well; but our world's not perfect; there are issues of energy; lack of food in developing nations; animosity between nations (ie. Israel and Palestine); and even on an individual level; family issues; money issues; health issues (especially in North America); and well; it can get a little depressing at times when one really looks at how we as individuals and as a society deals with these issues.

What Ken does with his AQAL model is he provides a map that can hold many different perspectives and allows individuals to potentially tackle the above problems more effectively and also gives the 'average' individual that is part of integral life to apply these concepts and ideas in their daily lives; interact with others that feel the same way; and in a way; gives one hope that a 'better' future in which these issues can be handled more effectively in the world.

And your personal attacks on Ken Wilber and his ethics; are just unnecessary.  No one is perfect in this world, not even a 'fully enlightened' individual; everyone is still human.  As Christ said "If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her".

Indeed.

Cheers.

- Julius
--

JuliusKo.com
"Let's CHANGE the world TOGETHER..."

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Posted June 3rd, 2010 by admin
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true, and...

Posted June 4th, 2010 by stefano

"You don't need a theoretical framework to give life meaning. Spend time with your family. Take a walk in nature. Do some volunteer work. Enrol in an evening class. Or, just spend time on your own. You don't need a guru, a life coach or a cult leader. You can survive on your own."

 

I already do all those things. 

But I think you have a good point. People who are very vulnerable, with low self esteem, and low engagement with life -- people who want saving, and are willing to pay someone to "save them" -- people who desperately need help (I know people like this, and I used to be there myself 20 years ago) -- these people, unfortunately, can't be "helped", even if the help was genuine and good. You can tell them the answers to everything and even give them money, but nothing happens.

The change has to come from within. You can see them suffering but there's nothing you can do -- I'm no life coach I'm just a guy talking about a few family members here. So it is up to them. It is up to you. It is up to me.

Nobody else will save me. 

When I'm not walking in the woods with my wife on a lovely day, I sometimes like to read, and sometimes some of what I read isn't junk. But it is always up to me to get what I can from the book, because it is my friggen life here and nobody but nobody will save me.

Live well.

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Well

Posted June 4th, 2010 by Sebastian Stark

 

Can i really listen to you?

I cant find no argumentation in what you write, no sense, nothing constructive,

and just btw it could very well be that you rape little children and murdered your parents!!!! OMG!!!

Who knows?

Maybe your the dark side of Ken? Or a gorvernement agent?

Who knows, who knows.

Given that I cant think by myself(Im part of the integral movement because I am the victim of physical torture by badass Integralist satanists everday, its a tough life man, they are EVERYWHERE) I cant really judge. BUT?!?!:

Maybe you could tell me right from wrong?

: ) : ) : )

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Interesting

Posted June 4th, 2010 by Christophe Witz

Hello Matsumoto,

I think you are funny. Look at these other comments: no one answered your questions, cause they were all caught by the "Don't you dare critize my Idol" Shadow. Except Stefano, who is thoughtful and balanced as always.

Myself I have no Idea what your questions even mean. But I do think that you are right that KW is probably a little bit embarrased by what his innocent little Integral Project has become; at least he should be. But to be fair, he always said or implied that he is only selling water at the river - I don't blame him for the stupidity of his followers. And yes, he is naked on his website. What's that supposed to mean? ("Look, Mommy, he got no clothes on") he he.

What is needed here is some serious deconstruction. Too bad that this is the very thing Integralites react allergic against. "Oh, no! It's a mean greenie again" WTF. How ironic that the curse became the cure, eh...

bye

--

>Five Star General of the Seven Armies, Archon of Atlantis<

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Posted June 4th, 2010 by admin
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