Note: We are using a new streaming platform called RiverSide, which requires you to open the link above in either Google Chrome or Microsoft Edge. Or you can download the Riverside app on your mobile device.

In this interview, we’ll dive into the concept of the Structure/Content Fallacy (SCF), a framework that brings fresh clarity to developmental theory. The SCF highlights a critical distinction that is often blurred in Integral discourse: the difference between developmental mindsets, or Structures, and cultural belief alignments, or Content.

David and Keith will unpack how current shorthand color schemes, like Red, Amber, Orange, and Green, inadvertently collapse these two important domains, leading to oversimplification and confusion. The SCF proposes a corrective lens that keeps the familiar Integral colors but differentiates between developmental Altitude (levels) and cultural Attitude (beliefs), allowing for a more accurate and practical application of Integral aspirations.

During the conversation, we’ll explore key areas, including:

• The intersection of Kegan’s developmental model and Integral colors, with a focus on 3rd Order/Amber, 4th Order/Orange, and 5th Order/Green*Yellow.
• Paul Ray’s work on value stacks such as Traditionalism, Modernism, and Progressivism, examining how different cultural groups align with Amber, Orange, and Green perspectives.
• How the SCF framework provides a more accurate map for understanding the culture wars and our current realities.
• A deep dive into the “Corrective Lens” SCF offers, showcasing examples of how developmental stages express themselves similarly across cultural lines, and how cultural groups can support vertical development within their domains.

Finally, we’ll discuss what “Right Action” might look like when viewed through the SCF framework, and how this approach can enhance the overall health of the developmental spiral, guiding individual growth and transformation across all levels.

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David Arrell is an Executive Coach & Consultant with a background in Entrepreneurship and Leadership Development & Training. He is passionate about both personal and professional growth and supporting those making meaningful and positive change in the world.  

Keith Martin-Smith is an ordained Zen priest, and the author of When the Buddha Needs Therapy, released by Integral Life Press in 2022. Ken Wilber said it was, “a terrific book, fully embracing a truly integral perspective and highly recommended.”