Conversations From the Road

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n my travels, I’ve been privileged to sit down with members of the Integral Life community and talk with them about their lives, their growth and what’s on their minds. During these meetings I make it clear that I’m not a coach, and as they are pro bono, I can’t guarantee any specific outcomes. I’m just an experienced integral practitioner who can listen and act as a sounding board to help friends think through issues in their lives. You are invited to listen in to those conversations we have received permission to publish. They are raw, mostly unedited, and often occur in cafes on the busy streets of European cities. I hope you enjoy.

—Robb Smith

PS: If you are in Europe this summer or Asia this fall and would like to connect with me, please let me know by either sending me an email (talktorobb [at] or by sending me a direct message on Twitter (if you’re interested in more frequent live updates on where I’ll be, I recommend you follow me on Twitter as I’ll post them there). I very much look forward to getting to know you and what’s on your integral mind.

As you listen to this conversation, you can use the Notes app in the bottom-left corner of your screen to record any reflections that may come up for you.


Greg Blair, Paris

Greg and I caught up in Paris to discuss the dilemma of attuning to one’s purpose when a job seems prosaic and not particularly growth-inducing. It’s safe to say we went far afield!

In this wide-ranging discussion, we talk about the opportunity for the emergence of integral marketing and whether it could transform lives. Along the way we get into how Apple is really a spiritual enterprise, how you escape a prison of your own making, and how integral post-metaphysics and the principles it entails seem well-designed to help us surf the waves of this era—the historical disruption we seem to be living in (what I’ve called “the great release”). We touch on why Twitter sucks, the prime directive to serve the health of the spiral, and why you shouldn’t introduce your friends to integral when you’re first getting into it (even though I’m now convinced we can actually create integral people). We end by talking about how to preserve your fullness and freedom by being wary of spaces of commitment, and of spaces of identity, that might prevent you from living an integral life.

Here’s Greg’s reflections a month after our discussion:

I came to Robb with a choice between two paths: transform what I have or create something new. I was sure that what I had at this moment was unacceptable, and that there were very strict “right” or “wrong” actions I could take with respect to it. Robb’s counsel has helped me to see that there is really much less of a “hard choice” to be made, and that whichever decision I do take is essentially ok, given my meaning structure. If an exploration through the green altitude is what pulls me, then go on that. If it’s something else that makes me feel alive, then go with that. Something in me had been policing: telling me that where I had been arriving to was not yet acceptable and therefore I must fix it, quickly. However, this rigid, binary perspective actually ignores the whole developmental aspect of life. We are all working through our imperfections, and we are imperfect as a necessity of evolution. Without having this acceptance for myself, it would be difficult to really accept where everyone else is in the course of their evolution. The problem I came with has more or less dissolved with this understanding, and this acceptance allows me to be where I am and to accept where change naturally will unfold from.

— Greg Blair


Jorge Ochoa, Paris


“How do we create a Teal company that is economically sustainable? That, in one sentence, is one of the defining problems of the 21st century today.” — Robb Smith

How do we integrate the aggression of the Red stage of consciousness into service of a modern Orange-stage economy? How do we reconcile ourselves to the fierce competition and individualism called for in many of today’s social environments while also staying true to our deepest desire for, and value of, service to the broader community? That’s the central theme of this talk between Robb and Jorge Ochoa, a Mexican ex-pat living in France who left a corporate track at Unilever as a young man and spent the past twenty years living in a cloistered co-living community, only to decide it was now time to re-enter the world as an integral practitioner. Touching on everything from the evolution of social bodies, to the need to “know thyself” as you navigate the individual-collective polarity as you grow, this talk may be helpful to anyone who wonders how to better integrate the entire spiral within themselves in order to be of highest service.

Here’s Jorge’s reflections a little while after the discussion:

I discovered my allergy to the word “competition” and all that is related to it. I can feel in my body, in my guts, how this concept and what it represents for me has been rejected, feared, judged as something “diabolic” and therefore has fed my intellectual conviction of the superiority of collective holons over individual holons. Today I’m invited to work on all these shadows within myself, to clean up my notion of autonomy, self-desire and self-conviction, disidentifying them from egoism, individuality, narcissism or guilt. This way I’ll be able to know myself better, to respect myself, my choices, my history, and gain the self-confidence to show up as I really am.

— Jorge Ochoa

Robb Smith

About Robb Smith

Robb Smith is a leading thinker on the Transformation Age and the global Integral Philosophy movement. He is the co-founder and CEO of Integral Life and Integral Ventures.

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